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Islam's Decline



a couple of members have posted about all the christian conversions to islam.

In light of that, I found this interesting 


Islam's Decline

A very interesting article from Pajamas Media about Islam's decline
. Quoting an article by an Islamic scholar:

Islam used to represent … Africa’s main religion and there were 30 African languages that used to be written in Arabic script. The number of Muslims in Africa has diminished to 316 million, half of whom are Arabs in North Africa. So in the section of Africa that we are talking about, the non-Arab section, the number of Muslims does not exceed 150 million people. When we realize that the entire population of Africa is one billion people, we see that the number of Muslims has diminished greatly from what it was in the beginning of the last century.

On the other hand, the number of Catholics has increased from one million in 1902 to 329 million 882 thousand (329,882,000). Let us round off that number to 330 million in the year 2000.

As to how that happened, well there are now 1.5 million churches whose congregations account for 46 million people. In every hour, 667 Muslims convert to Christianity. Everyday, 16,000 Muslims convert to Christianity. Every year, 6 million Muslims convert to Christianity. These numbers are very large indeed.

Pajamas Media goes on to point out that some of the conversion of Muslims to Christianity represents a repudiation of tyrannical state religion in places like Iran and the former Soviet Union:

Although al-Qataani points to Africa, there is another phenomenon based on repulsion from Islamist dictatorship, corruption, and terrorist violence. In Iran as many as 1 million people have surreptitiously converted to Evangelical Christianity in the last five years. Pastor Hormoz Shariat claims to have converted 50,000 of them through his U.S.-based Farsi-language satellite ministry. He contrasts the upswing to the efforts of evangelical missionaries in Iran between 1830 and 1979, whose 149 years of work built a Christian community of only 3,000. One Iranian religious scholar believes youth are abandoning Islam because it is identified with the corrupt Iranian government. Now the Iranian Majlis (parliament) is debating the death penalty for conversion.


In southern Russia the same pattern is emerging. According to Roman Silantyev, executive secretary of the Inter-religious Council in Russia, freed from atheist control, two million Muslims converted to Christianity. Repulsed by bloody terrorist attacks, those living in areas such as Beslan have converted to Christianity in the greatest numbers of all. As many as 100,000 have converted to Christianity in post-Soviet Kyrgyzstan.

After decades of Islamist war, evangelicals report thousands of sub-rosa converts in rural areas of Kashmir. Says one churchgoer: “I am interested in this religion. I hate violence. I hate fundamentalists in Islam. I come here to seek peace.” An Indian newspaper headline reads: “Urban Muslim Youth Out to Junk Faith.”


05:18 PM Apr 11 2008 |

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b4 I answer u I have to say to u Stop saying its free Speech ? well Oh please Grow up … This is Prophet not a normal person like me and u and he is Biggest than Stupid draws

well if u support free speech then I will draw u like a killer and animal ? well u accpet that ?


Yes, I support free speech. I accept you drawing me as a killer and an animal. If you do so and send it to me, I promise that I will add the picture to my profile and make it my avatar.


YOU say Muhammad is a prophet. I do not. I find him to be a suitable subject for either praise or ridicule, as I do for any person, or for that matter your god or anyone else's god.


and dunt lie to ur self and to us and say .. Oh Yup I accpet it coz its free Speech? never lie and say that coz noone will accpet the offence for himself .. So Week up >>


I will not continue to have this discussion if you insist on using tactics like this. You may not accept that offense, but I do. You call me a liar before I even speak. It is pointless to have a discussion of you plan to accuse me of lying and therefore will not accept any statement I make if it doesn't fit with your view of how I should respond. If you want to perform intellectual masturbation, feel free, but I'd rather not watch.

09:11 PM Apr 13 2008 |



Lets see, threating to kill the cartoonists, the publishers of the cartoons and threatening their workplace, attacking embassies, killing nuns, that's fine, as long as no one offends jesus.  


hahaha really u made me laught .. Excuse me dude these reactions are normal and if u were the christen in our place I bet u would do more than this


Normal reactions you say. Perhaps. It's those types of "normal" reactions that are giving your religion a bad name around the world.

I am not a Christian, but I have not seen the same reactions from them in response to what they consider blasphemous images of Christ. Can you show me where that has happened?  A Iranian man has published a video in response to Fitna that purportedly shows Christian violence against the backdrop of violent verses from the Bible. As far as I know, no mosques have been vandalized, no embassies attacked, no death threats have been made by radical Christians. Perhaps that's a "normal" reaction by members of that faith. 




 So dunt run from my Qiz and answer the Qiz with clear answer ?!> or u want me to answer it by myself?

 I think I answered all your questions. Maybe not the one about have I seen muslims offending jesus. No, I haven't. Can jesus be offended if he is dead. But if I've not seen it, proves what? Only that muslims don't say bad things about someone they think was a prophet. Christians don't generally do that either. So what?


 Good of you to admit that. I don't know who was meant by "u people" either, that's why I asked.  


admit to what ?> please week-up when u read coz ( u poeple ) its clear and even the kid will understand it : )


When you wrote  "I dunno the answer"  I see now perhaps you meant I was implying that.  I didn't indeed know. I suspect now, that you meant "you christians" but that would not be accurate since I am not a christian. So did you mean that or some other group I belong to?

09:22 PM Apr 13 2008 |



Well excuse me but every thing in this world is the evedince that Islam is real we dunt need u or any one to tell us is it true or not  as long as we beleive in it we dunt need that ...


No, you don't need anyone to tell you that it's true. So why try to defend it as true by implying that since people fight you, it must be real and true. 

Perhaps you realize now that it's a stupid argument.  

09:26 PM Apr 13 2008 |



 it only shows how horrible all religion is for mankind

Religion it helped us to walk in the right way and mankind is the horrible indeed coz they are the people who have the brain .. and too bad coz alot of people have small minds which means that they never turn their mind on ,,, and that's why they dunt want to stop these wars coz they are only people with small mind

I'm perfectly capable of walking the right way without religion, and I think everyone else is too. I disagree that mankind is inherently evil or horrible. Morality and decent behavior are evolved traits and it's in people's best interests to generally 'walk in the right way' religion isn't needed for that.


I agree, however, that the cycle of violence in many cases is caused by people who don't think so well.



So we beleive in what we beleive .. u beleive in what u beleive what is the wrong with that ? !>every one have his brain to think about what is beliving so what is the problem?


No problem. You can believe what you want, and you should have the freedom to do so. I hope you would grant me the same. When you try to limit what I can believe or put me in fear of violence should I express that belief, I have a problem.


Remember to please send me the picture of me as a killer and an animal. Thanks 

09:32 PM Apr 13 2008 |



Yes, I support free speech. I accept you drawing me as a killer and an animal. If you do so and send it to me, I promise that I will add the picture to my profile and make it my avatar.

then u are one of both .. lier or a person with no self steem


Well I am no liar. Please send me the picture and I promise to keep my end of the deal. You are free to think what you wish about my self esteem.  

YOU say Muhammad is a prophet. I do not. I find him to be a suitable subject for either praise or ridicule, as I do for any person, or for that matter your god or anyone else's god.


look gkisseberth dont cross ur lines here ? If im talking respectly that's coz my

behaviors not allowing me to say bad things and replay u in ur Attacking way  but if u crossed it I would never sit and watch u saying Stupid stuff that u dunt know what u even talking about ?> So stop and Respect ur self in this point and if u have no selfsteem for ur self Then Dun't Get ur self in something that u can not face it …



Can you please describe how my arguments are attacking? Am I attacking you personally, or Muhammad, or muslims, and how. If I am attacking anything, it is your weak logic or arguments. I'm sure you are a fine and decent person and I have no desire to attack your person, despite your calling me a liar.


I can indeed face whatever you think I cannot. If you think I secretly fear you characterizing me as a killer or animal (maybe a killer animal – if I have a choice, I think I would like to be a mountain lion or a maybe a shark) then you are dead wrong. I welcome it.  



First why u run away from My Qiz  ?> why u didn't answer it ? Mashallah u relplied every thing expect my Qiz ? Wow what intrested thing huh ?


Again, I think I answered all your questions, but this exchange has been a little convoluted, so forgive me if I missed one, and if you ask it again, I will try to answer it.  



and its not u who will not continue this converstion it is me indeed coz


1 >> Yup u ar alier and im saying to u coz this is my first time I see some one who says Dram me like an animal ? What a big fib .. 


I don't know what I can do to convince you except say again, please go ahead. Send it to me and I will post it in my profile and make it my avatar for all to see. You have my permission to depict me in any way you see fit and I promise I will take no action against you.  


2>> You have no respect for us as muslims while we are respecting u but it seems like u dunt deserve the respect


I have respect for you as a person.



Finally >> Instead of Fighting The Islam go and get a life


thanks, I have a nice one, and having stimulating discussions here is a part of it. 


If you'd ever like to come to Colombia, I'd love to show you some of the great things in my life. You are welcome in my home.  




09:43 PM Apr 13 2008 |



why try to defend it as true by implying that since people fight you, it must be real and true. 

Perhaps you realize now that it's a stupid argument.

I found out that u ar one of these people who have small mind … Smile


thanks. First a liar, then low self esteem and now a small mind. You continue to attack me personally, but I will endure it because I really want my picture.  Wink

and the answer is

1 >>Coz I'm Real muslim which means I will not sit in my home and watch Tv while people are suffering out ther ? which means also I will always defent my Religion with everything I have ..


That's good. Defending what you believe in is an admirable trait. I only suggest choosing a better argument to defend it. I've seen plenty of arguments on this site "proving" that Islam is the best and truest religion, but none as silly as "if it wasn't right, you people wouldn't be fighting it"



2>> Coz if we wasn't right then u people will never attack us .. well Face it :)

And there, you just made it again.  


Perhaps you realize now that it's a stupid argument.

hahahahah Maybe the opposite is right ..

No, it's still a stupid argument. It makes you look silly when you keep using it. 



09:49 PM Apr 13 2008 |




b4 I go up and Answers u no u didn't anwer My qiz which is

Have u ever seen Any muslim offending The jesus ? which means have any Muslim draw the Jesus and spread these

Caricature out ?


I answered your question in my post with this time stamp: 

02:22 PM Apr 13 2008


Of course when you originally asked the question, I assumed it was rhetorical since you told us what the answer must be.  

09:54 PM Apr 13 2008 |



I answered your question in my post with this time stamp:

02:22 PM Apr 13 2008

do u call that an answer ? Wow now I know that .. U still running bra… Coz u know the answer is No I never have seen any Muslim Drawing the Jesus coz we beleive in Him .. : ) thats the answer ,,,<<< which ur kept running of


My answer was "No, I haven't" My answer was the same as yours (maybe i cheated, because you gave the answer as soon as you finished the question)

So what is the issue. That I didn't answer quickly enough? Perhaps you should give me a break because of my low self esteem and small brain. ;) 


Can you please describe how my arguments are attacking?

 Prophet Mohmmed never was and will never be a title of redicule …

Perhaps not from you or from other muslims, but it's a fact, Muhammad has been and will continue to be ridiculed. I have not done so, however. 


 Am I attacking you personally,

 Why would u attack me if I was wrong ? coz If I was wrong then why u care to attack me ?

I am not attacking you, only your ideas. If I thought your ideas were right, then I would have no reason to attack them. You continue with this twisted idea that if you are being attacked you must be right.



 or Muhammad, or muslims, and how. If I am attacking anything, it is your weak logic or arguments.

 Ok Then if muslims Attacking u then it would be for the same reason

Perhaps. But you seem to be focused more on characterizing me as a liar and someone with low self esteem than addressing my ideas.  


And when I called u Lier coz noone will accpet the offence for himself … noone wants to walk in the street and people calling him oh u big animal ?


No, you're right, I probably wouldn't like that, but I respect your right to do it. I know that some speech or ideas might offend me, might make me feel angry, or might annoy or upset me, but I accept them, because I feel that freedome of expression is more important than protecting my feelings. I feel the same way about the freedom to offend muslims by printing a cartoon about Muhammad. If your feelings are hurt, too bad.  


You continue to attack me personally, but I will endure it because I really want my picture

If Im attacking thats coz u are attacking too ..

I asked you to show me how I am attacking you personally.  


but I will endure it because I really want my picture


there is an old saying says … Words its easy . verbs its Hard …

 So with all plessure dude .. ^_*

Very cool, I will look forward to seeing it soon. 


Finally >> I hope u good life   Thanks

10:57 PM Apr 13 2008 |



hahahahahah really u made me laught alot dude will as I told u b4 week-up ok and ride ur car and have a close look at the muslims countries.. we never ever kill innocent people


I didn't mention killing, although response to the printing of the cartoons has resulting in that.  I said "fear of violence". Look at some of the responses below and tell me that if I print a caricature of Muhammad and print it in my newspaper, I should not be afraid of violence.

The website that originally hosted the film FITNA removed it after a day because of death threats against the owners and employees. Courageously, they reversed that decision, but few will be surprised if some violence does come to them.  




In response to the publication of the drawings, the UK Islamist group al Ghurabaa publish an article on their website entitled, "Kill those who insult the Prophet Muhammad". The article states, "The insulting of the Messenger Muhammad (saw) is something that the Muslims cannot and will not tolerate and the punishment in Islam for the one who does so is death. This is the sunnah of the prophet and the verdict of Islam upon such people, one that any Muslim is able execute."[67] al Ghurabaa had organised the 3 February protest march from London Central Mosque to the Danish Embassy[68][69] where protesters waived placards reading, "Butcher those who mock Islam", "Kill those who insult Islam", "Europe you will pay, your 9/11 is on the way", or "7/7 is on its way", "Europe you will pay, Bin Laden is on his way" and "Europe you'll come crawling, when the Mujahideen come roaring". Despite the similar theme on Al Ghurabaa's website, their spokesman, Anjem Choudary, said he did not know who wrote the placards.[70] MPs from all parties condemned the protest, calling the Metropolitan police to pursue those responsible on the grounds that the threats were an incitement to murder.[71]


On January 29 six churches in the Iraqi cities of Baghdad and Kirkuk were targeted by car bombs, killing 13-year-old worshipper Fadi Raad Elias. No militants claimed to be retaliating for the pictures, nor is this the first time Iraqi churches have been bombed;[72] but the bishop of the church stated "The church blasts were a reaction to the cartoons published in European papers. But Christians are not responsible for what is published in Europe."[73] Many Assyrians in Iraq now feel like "Westerners should not give wild statements [as] everyone can attack us [in response]" and "Today I'm afraid to walk the streets, because I'm Christian."[74] On February 5, thousands of Muslims in Lebanon surrounded the Maronite Catholic Church and threw stones at it.[75]

On February 6, an Italian Catholic priest named Andrea Santoro was reported to have been shot dead at the door-step of his church in the Black Sea port city Trabzon. The convict, arrested on February 7 who is a Turkish Muslim youth aged 16, told the public attorney that his action was motivated by cartoons protests. [12]

Also on February 6, leaflets were distributed in Ramadi, Iraq by the militant group "The Military Wing for the Army of Justice" demanding Christians to "halt their religious rituals in churches and other worship places because they insulted Islam and Muslims." [13] and [14]

On February 18, 2006, eleven churches, as well as several Christian-owned businesses, in northern Nigeria were burned by protesters.[76]

[edit] Fatwa

Also on January 29, a Muslim Cleric in the Iraqi city of Mosul issued a fatwa stating, "Expel the Crusaders and infidels from the streets, schools, and institutions because they have offended the person of the prophet."[77] It has been reported that Muslim students beat up a Christian student at Mosul University in response to the fatwa on the same day.[77] On February 2, some Palestinians in the West Bank handed out a leaflet signed by Islamic Jihad stating, "Churches in Gaza could come under attack".[78]

The Danish government announced that a fatwa had been declared against the Danish troops stationed in Iraq. The government responded by heightening security for its troops.[79]


Burning embassies

On February 4, the Danish and Norwegian embassies in Damascus, Syria were set on fire, after being stormed by an angry mob. Within the building housing the Danish embassy were the Chilean and Swedish embassies, both having no formal connection to the present row.[80]. As it was a holiday, no one was present inside the building when this occurred, so no one was hurt. As a response to this incident, the Danish and Norwegian Ministries of Foreign Affairs issued a warning, urging their citizens in Syria to leave the country immediately. The German Cultural Centre in Gaza was raided by Palestinian students[81]

On February 5, the Danish consulate in Lebanon was set on fire by demonstrators, reportedly police and military tried to restrain them from doing so.

In Tehran, on February 6, the Danish and Norwegian embassies were attacked by protestors. According to reports, homemade grenades were thrown at the embassies. However, the embassies weren't set ablaze.

On October 19, ten ambassadors from Islamic countries, including Algeria, Bosnia-Herzegovina, Egypt, Indonesia, Iran, Morocco, Pakistan, Libya, Saudi Arabia, and Turkey, as well as the head of the Palestinian delegation in Denmark, sent a letter to Prime Minister Anders Fogh Rasmussen requesting a meeting and asking him to distance himself from hate speech, including remarks by MP Louise Frevert, Culture Minister of Denmark Brian Mikkelsen, and the Radio Holger station.[82] Rasmussen declined, saying that the government could not interfere with the right to free speech, but said that cases of blasphemy and discrimination could be tried before the courts,[83] a reaction essentially seen as a snub by the Muslims.[84]

On February 18, the Italian consulate in Benghazi, Libya, was set on fire by demonstrators. Police fired into the crowd, killing 11.




11:15 PM Apr 13 2008 |




I was sitting with a French guy,he read some comments and i will say exactly what is his opinion about some people here:

GK: about mentioning the ppl of Africa he agreed on the same analyse, he said also: are you  sure of the numbers?!!.

Mark: he is smart and he has the ability to use events in a way may confuse you.

Jane: he said: instead of commenting her friend GK  first,she focused on muslims and forget that Gk was the first who started this, so people like that i will never care  what they are talking about. Thats all.

Gk: yes you are right that the thread didn't mention the level of education,, if we compare between Europe and Africa, you will see that i was right in my analyse

Kana: u propose urself as an example,but u are stupid to not notice that i've montioned this :i've witnessed some cases, the main reason was ignorance and for money. u state urself as an example,,i will state many examples to prove that what i've said is true and saying that they are stupid examples is  a way to not face  the truth wich shows that Church is using MONEY and Beatiful girls as a mean,i think that the thread of GK included them as people who converted to Christianity not as a stupid example.

02:12 PM Apr 14 2008 |